11:08 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Welcome to Address Policy WG Second and las session at RIPE 65. My name is Kaveh Ranjbar from RIPE NCC. I will be monitoring chat during this session. If you have a question or comment, I can read it out for you. Please make your questions as clear as possible. I will read out any questions when the speaker asks for questions at the end of his/her presentation. Please note that all chat transcripts will be archived and made available t
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11:09 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert Speaking, slide 19 of https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/227-wg.pdf
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11:09 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> We are contacting Tore on Skype for remote participation
11:10 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Tore is going to remotely present https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/231-20120926-RIPE65-Policy_Proposal_2012-06_Revert_Run_Out_Fairly_After_IPv4_Depletion.pdf
11:11 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Tore (on skype) is on the big screen
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11:12 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> The proposal is direct unpatching of the policy
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11:12 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Tore: run out fairly has no purpose anymore
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11:18 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Remco: Strongly support the proposal
11:18 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> any other comments?
11:18 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> questions?
11:19 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert: I am taking the comments from Nina this morning as support as well
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11:19 * Eimann strongly supports it too
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11:19 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert: It is in the discussion phase, and after that we can go forward with it
11:20 < Eimann> tore: nice :) that worked well
11:20 < masterF00> finally, a Skype session that worked!
11:20 < rvs> very nice
11:20 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert presenting slide 20 of https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/260-wg.pdf
11:20 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Nick Hilliard presenting https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/262-inex-ripe-apwg-amsterdam-pi-lastslash8-2012-09-27.key
11:20 < tore> I started getting myself echoing back which was really distracting
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11:21 < Eimann> stop drinking in the morning :-P
11:21 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Tore: From our side, it went really well
11:21 < rvs> I'm adjusting my "never doesn't work" point of view from now on
11:21 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Some technical issues with Nick's presentation
11:22 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Ok, Nick is presenting https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/262-inex-ripe-apwg-amsterdam-pi-lastslash8-2012-09-27.key
11:22 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> PI Assignments from the last /8
11:22 < masterF00> the iOS stream does lag terribly and gets asynchronous audio/video for me unfortunately, so no much comments from me this time :-/
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11:23 < Eimann> I want 185.185.185.0/24 please, I would return another PI /24 for it ;-)
11:23 < teun-12859> hehe
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11:27 < Eimann> hmmm cake
11:28 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Yes, I will ask Nick later if these are stock images or if actually bought a Cake, eaten it and has taken the pictures during the process :)
11:28 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Wilfried is speaking: He has a good reason to support the proposal
11:29 < Eimann> hehe :)
11:30 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Wilfried is not supporting at the moment, because he misses some additions for the policy, mainly because there is no preventation from getting PI and transferring it
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11:31 < boggits> Q would imposing a time limit before a transfer not be the simplest solution to that?
11:31 < boggits> (james blessing)
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11:32 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> I will read it, I am in the queue
11:33 < Eimann> ooops, queue drop
11:33 < SLU-RIPE> it is not restricted to new LIRs
11:34 < SLU-RIPE> where does that myth come from?
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11:34 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Any other questions?
11:36 < Eliot> Yes: the Pie is wrong. We are now talking about divvying up crumbs.
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11:38 < ripe610> unfairness means A can get it but B can't because of of policy. that's not the case. anyone can get more space and everyone is treated equally
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11:39 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> ripe610: Do you want me to read that? in that case, please kindly state your name and affiliation.
11:39 < ripe610> no, thanks
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11:40 < Eliot> no
11:41 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> james are you happy with answer?
11:42 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Remco speaking.
11:42 * boggits starts writing a PI transfer policy just to wind remco up....
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11:47 < Eliot> small bucks?
11:50 < Eimann> hmm
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11:51 < SLU-RIPE> oh for crying out loud, just man up and drop the PA/PI distinction already
11:51 < SLU-RIPE> it serves no purpose, certainly not now
11:52 < Eimann> I don't see the fuzz about v4 anymore. Sure, the last steps should be clarified. But I do not see v4 as "needed" anymore. There should just be a lot of pain in the next years for v4 users to make them move ...
11:52 < Robert_NCC> :-)
11:52 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> For the one who have joined the room recently: Welcome to Address Policy WG Second and last session at RIPE 65. My name is Kaveh Ranjbar from RIPE NCC. I will be monitoring chat during this session. If you have a question or comment, I can read it out for you. Please make your questions as clear as possible. I will read out any questions when the speaker asks for questions at the end of his/her presentation. Please note that all chat t
11:52 < Eimann> KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC: Your line is cut off ater "Please not that all chat t"
11:52 < Robert_NCC> (personal opinion) it's funny to hear people arguing about what color the non-existing addresses should be painted :-)
11:52 < teun-12859> I've seen that happen to more NCC people posting this text
11:53 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Current discussion are about PI Assignments from last /8, the slides are https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/262-inex-ripe-apwg-amsterdam-pi-lastslash8-2012-09-27.key, Nick Hilliard from INEX is presenting
11:53 < solis> This seperation would get iffy at the point when there will be PA-Space reclaimed from 185/8 :)
11:53 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> to be exact Nick is actually answering questions now
11:54 < Eliot> who is this?
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11:56 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Alexy Ivanov from LEader TElecom
11:56 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Leader Telecom
11:56 < Eliot> thanks
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11:57 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Ivan Beveridge, Betfair is now asking question
11:58 < SLU-RIPE> ask him what odds he gives on the policy passing ;)
11:59 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> SLU-RIPE: I would really love to do that, but as an NCC employee I have to stay neutral ;)
11:59 < tore> question (for alex): how many new LIRs have signed up since depletion, and do you have any indication of this number is approx. the same as before, or if the sign up rate has sharply increased?
12:00 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Should I read it Tore? or is it a direct question? I can pass it to him then
12:00 < tore> yes, read it please
12:00 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Ok
12:00 < Emilio_RIPENCC> Hi Tore, this information is also available in the presentation of Andrea Cima at NCC Service WG
12:01 < Eliot> for the mic: i don't see many lawyes in the room, and would suggest that the matter be referred to council, but absent that opinion, i see no reason why one wuld consider the policy based on such a threat.
12:01 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Eliot plese identify
12:01 < Eliot> Eliot Lear, Cisco
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12:02 < tore> ok - but it is really relevant for apwg. because if end users are working around the "no PI" rule by becoming lirs, then maybe repealing the no PI rule isn't really worth the trouble
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12:02 < Emilio_RIPENCC> the presentation is available at
12:02 < Emilio_RIPENCC> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/204-last_slash_8_NCC_Services.pdf
12:02 < Emilio_RIPENCC> yes, sure
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12:02 < Eliot> thank you, Kaveh
12:03 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Anytime. Just doing my job.
12:03 < Eliot> tore, i think we're in agreement.
12:03 < tore> thank you, yes
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12:05 < Eliot> and if they have to go to the market it will cost even more.
12:05 < Eliot> (no need to say that at the mic)
12:05 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> :) Sure
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12:07 < Eliot> i love that child analogy
12:09 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert (Co-chair) has closed the queue. Only the current comment and the last one will be from Remco.
12:09 < lochii> good
12:10 < lochii> we're currently running into lunch time depletion
12:10 < Eliot> ;-)
12:10 < Robert_NCC> is that fair? :-)
12:10 < ripe016> Last /Ate, huh?
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12:12 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Nick has left the stage
12:12 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert: it is clear that the proposal on the table is not what we want
12:12 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> We need to come up with a new one.
12:13 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Gert, the next presentation 2012-05 (Item G)
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12:13 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Remote presentation by Milton Mueller
12:14 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> https://ripe65.ripe.net/presentations/260-wg.pdf , slides start from page 21
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12:15 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> We have Milton on skype, projected on the big screen
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12:18 < AlexBand> I'm intrigued by the painting on the wall behind Milton...
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12:20 < solis> Support from Jan Dirnberger, SpaceNet
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12:21 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> I will give it to the chairs
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12:21 < KavehRanjbar_RIPENCC> Thank you everyone, the session is now being closed
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